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	<title>Comments on: What people are redeeming their RecycleBank rewards points for</title>
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	<link>http://ellensmith.org/blog/2009/06/09/what-people-are-redeeming-their-recyclebank-rewards-points-for/</link>
	<description>I&#039;m Ellen Smith, member of the Oak Ridge City Council. Thank you for visiting my blog and reading my views on public and private life in and around Oak Ridge, Tennessee. This website is my own; content here does not represent the official policies or views of the City of Oak Ridge. To add your own comments, click on the topic title to open a comment box. To read posts about a particular topic, scroll down to &#34;Categories&#34; (in the sidebar) or use the &#34;Search&#34; box in the sidebar. Look under &#34;Archives&#34; to see collections of past posts organized by date.</description>
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		<title>By: Ray Kircher</title>
		<link>http://ellensmith.org/blog/2009/06/09/what-people-are-redeeming-their-recyclebank-rewards-points-for/comment-page-1/#comment-39093</link>
		<dc:creator>Ray Kircher</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 17 Jun 2009 14:07:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ellensmith.org/blog/?p=237#comment-39093</guid>
		<description>show us how our work and payments have covered their costs (since they have an oil and tree  estimate meter for Mother Naure) showing how we have recovered what they use in raw materials for our program</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>show us how our work and payments have covered their costs (since they have an oil and tree  estimate meter for Mother Naure) showing how we have recovered what they use in raw materials for our program</p>
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		<title>By: Ray Kircher</title>
		<link>http://ellensmith.org/blog/2009/06/09/what-people-are-redeeming-their-recyclebank-rewards-points-for/comment-page-1/#comment-39092</link>
		<dc:creator>Ray Kircher</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 17 Jun 2009 14:02:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ellensmith.org/blog/?p=237#comment-39092</guid>
		<description>&quot;but the increase in recycling collections was impressive&quot;
Was this due to the expansion of garbage accepted as recyclable?

5500 tonnes of Lothians rubbish sent for recycling ends up in landfill 
http://news.scotsman.com/scotlandsgreencampaigns/5500-tonnes-of-Lothians-rubbish.5064500.jp

‘Recycled’ waste dumped in landfill
http://women.timesonline.co.uk/tol/life_and_style/women/the_way_we_live/article1875550.ece

&quot;The plastics industry wants people to understand that all plastics are recyclable,&quot; said Davis. &quot;That may be technically possible, but it&#039;s not economically feasible. The high-tech sorting equipment costs half a million dollars apiece. That&#039;s the part they don&#039;t tell you.&quot;
http://www.seacoastonline.com/articles/20090601-NEWS-906010325

Ellen, the numbers that are relevant to true Recyclers is the tonnage headed to the Landfill and the products brought home made from recycled goods.  It is a two-way street or it doesn’t work. I see very little being done to support the buy recycled product coupons from Recycle Bank. Are we so arrogant to think that one source of filling recycle containers is the accomplishment while not filling the other source of buying goods made from recycled goods? How long will this extra garbage charge continue while Oak Ridgers and our own government will not buy recycled goods? Furthermore, I doubt we will see a lesser cost from landfill charges if anyone told Anderson County to reduce our garbage fees because we divert garbage via RecycleBank. RecycleBank is an incentive to cheat program, and Anderson County knows that RecycleBank has no bearing on how much to charge Oak Ridgers for landfill usage.

So nobody can get the amount of Garbage we send to the landfill; why does anyone think RecycleBank will reduce the amount of Garbage going into our landfill without those numbers?

The cost of our recycling program goes to infrastructure and jobs located in Knox County. How much do we need to recycle to cover the amount of raw materials used to build this program, and how much used was from recycled goods? Without the other end of this issue, Oak Ridgers will face even more costs of maintaining a recycling program while our landfill is continually filling with garbage that should be going to the multi-million dollar facility and trucks. More needs to be done; RecycleBank needs to provide more coupons for goods made from recycled materials, help by informing us of landfill tonnage from our community, show us how much RecycleBank throws away and why, show us how our work and payments have covered their costs since they have an oil and tree meter for Mother Naure showing how we have recovered what they use in raw materialfor our program, expand their program to include electronics, appliances, any metal from nails and screws to transportation parts used in our Central Services Complex.

I’m not against recycling, just showing how much we spend to do so little.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;but the increase in recycling collections was impressive&#8221;<br />
Was this due to the expansion of garbage accepted as recyclable?</p>
<p>5500 tonnes of Lothians rubbish sent for recycling ends up in landfill<br />
<a href="http://news.scotsman.com/scotlandsgreencampaigns/5500-tonnes-of-Lothians-rubbish.5064500.jp" rel="nofollow">http://news.scotsman.com/scotlandsgreencampaigns/5500-tonnes-of-Lothians-rubbish.5064500.jp</a></p>
<p>‘Recycled’ waste dumped in landfill<br />
<a href="http://women.timesonline.co.uk/tol/life_and_style/women/the_way_we_live/article1875550.ece" rel="nofollow">http://women.timesonline.co.uk/tol/life_and_style/women/the_way_we_live/article1875550.ece</a></p>
<p>&#8220;The plastics industry wants people to understand that all plastics are recyclable,&#8221; said Davis. &#8220;That may be technically possible, but it&#8217;s not economically feasible. The high-tech sorting equipment costs half a million dollars apiece. That&#8217;s the part they don&#8217;t tell you.&#8221;<br />
<a href="http://www.seacoastonline.com/articles/20090601-NEWS-906010325" rel="nofollow">http://www.seacoastonline.com/articles/20090601-NEWS-906010325</a></p>
<p>Ellen, the numbers that are relevant to true Recyclers is the tonnage headed to the Landfill and the products brought home made from recycled goods.  It is a two-way street or it doesn’t work. I see very little being done to support the buy recycled product coupons from Recycle Bank. Are we so arrogant to think that one source of filling recycle containers is the accomplishment while not filling the other source of buying goods made from recycled goods? How long will this extra garbage charge continue while Oak Ridgers and our own government will not buy recycled goods? Furthermore, I doubt we will see a lesser cost from landfill charges if anyone told Anderson County to reduce our garbage fees because we divert garbage via RecycleBank. RecycleBank is an incentive to cheat program, and Anderson County knows that RecycleBank has no bearing on how much to charge Oak Ridgers for landfill usage.</p>
<p>So nobody can get the amount of Garbage we send to the landfill; why does anyone think RecycleBank will reduce the amount of Garbage going into our landfill without those numbers?</p>
<p>The cost of our recycling program goes to infrastructure and jobs located in Knox County. How much do we need to recycle to cover the amount of raw materials used to build this program, and how much used was from recycled goods? Without the other end of this issue, Oak Ridgers will face even more costs of maintaining a recycling program while our landfill is continually filling with garbage that should be going to the multi-million dollar facility and trucks. More needs to be done; RecycleBank needs to provide more coupons for goods made from recycled materials, help by informing us of landfill tonnage from our community, show us how much RecycleBank throws away and why, show us how our work and payments have covered their costs since they have an oil and tree meter for Mother Naure showing how we have recovered what they use in raw materialfor our program, expand their program to include electronics, appliances, any metal from nails and screws to transportation parts used in our Central Services Complex.</p>
<p>I’m not against recycling, just showing how much we spend to do so little.</p>
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		<title>By: Ellen Smith</title>
		<link>http://ellensmith.org/blog/2009/06/09/what-people-are-redeeming-their-recyclebank-rewards-points-for/comment-page-1/#comment-39091</link>
		<dc:creator>Ellen Smith</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 17 Jun 2009 01:20:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ellensmith.org/blog/?p=237#comment-39091</guid>
		<description>Numbers exist regarding how much more material is being kept out of the landfill as a result of RecycleBank.  (Numbers were quoted to me yesterday. I don&#039;t remember the specific numbers and I wasn&#039;t in a position to write anything down, but the increase in recycling collections was impressive.) 

The Waste Connections folks assure us that everything they collect in the recycle carts goes to the materials recovery facility, and that it is still being sold. The good news in the last few days is that they say that prices for some recycle materials are beginning to inch back up.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Numbers exist regarding how much more material is being kept out of the landfill as a result of RecycleBank.  (Numbers were quoted to me yesterday. I don&#8217;t remember the specific numbers and I wasn&#8217;t in a position to write anything down, but the increase in recycling collections was impressive.) </p>
<p>The Waste Connections folks assure us that everything they collect in the recycle carts goes to the materials recovery facility, and that it is still being sold. The good news in the last few days is that they say that prices for some recycle materials are beginning to inch back up.</p>
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		<title>By: Ray Kircher</title>
		<link>http://ellensmith.org/blog/2009/06/09/what-people-are-redeeming-their-recyclebank-rewards-points-for/comment-page-1/#comment-39087</link>
		<dc:creator>Ray Kircher</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 16 Jun 2009 14:03:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ellensmith.org/blog/?p=237#comment-39087</guid>
		<description>That is where it is sorted. This where it is stored, the missing part to Mr. Abbatiello&#039;s story can be found here:

http://www.knoxnews.com/news/2009/may/08/recycling-eyesore-to-neighbor/</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>That is where it is sorted. This where it is stored, the missing part to Mr. Abbatiello&#8217;s story can be found here:</p>
<p><a href="http://www.knoxnews.com/news/2009/may/08/recycling-eyesore-to-neighbor/" rel="nofollow">http://www.knoxnews.com/news/2009/may/08/recycling-eyesore-to-neighbor/</a></p>
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		<title>By: Ray Evans</title>
		<link>http://ellensmith.org/blog/2009/06/09/what-people-are-redeeming-their-recyclebank-rewards-points-for/comment-page-1/#comment-39086</link>
		<dc:creator>Ray Evans</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 16 Jun 2009 13:13:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ellensmith.org/blog/?p=237#comment-39086</guid>
		<description>Didn&#039;t Gary Cinder Oak Ridge Public Works Director and former councilman Leonard Abbatiello tour the recycle facility in April?

http://www.oakridger.com/archive/x407219013/Trash-to-treasure-Oak-Ridge-Recycle-Program</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Didn&#8217;t Gary Cinder Oak Ridge Public Works Director and former councilman Leonard Abbatiello tour the recycle facility in April?</p>
<p><a href="http://www.oakridger.com/archive/x407219013/Trash-to-treasure-Oak-Ridge-Recycle-Program" rel="nofollow">http://www.oakridger.com/archive/x407219013/Trash-to-treasure-Oak-Ridge-Recycle-Program</a></p>
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		<title>By: Ray Kircher</title>
		<link>http://ellensmith.org/blog/2009/06/09/what-people-are-redeeming-their-recyclebank-rewards-points-for/comment-page-1/#comment-39085</link>
		<dc:creator>Ray Kircher</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 16 Jun 2009 12:32:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ellensmith.org/blog/?p=237#comment-39085</guid>
		<description>It is sad to see that the few people who do recycle in Oak Ridge have no evidence that garbage going to the landfill have been significantly reduced by this effort. I suspect it has done nothing more than what we were doing before as a city with a paid recycling service.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It is sad to see that the few people who do recycle in Oak Ridge have no evidence that garbage going to the landfill have been significantly reduced by this effort. I suspect it has done nothing more than what we were doing before as a city with a paid recycling service.</p>
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		<title>By: Ellen Smith</title>
		<link>http://ellensmith.org/blog/2009/06/09/what-people-are-redeeming-their-recyclebank-rewards-points-for/comment-page-1/#comment-39082</link>
		<dc:creator>Ellen Smith</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 15 Jun 2009 14:31:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ellensmith.org/blog/?p=237#comment-39082</guid>
		<description>Costs of landfilling are paid by Anderson County, not by the City, so getting an accounting is not a straightforward matter. However, as Ray Evans says, the amounts going to the landfill have surely been reduced. 

During the recent economic mess, our local hauler, (Waste Connections) says that recycling costs them more than it used to because markets are soft. The company is absorbing these costs, not their contractual customers (like the City of Oak Ridge).</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Costs of landfilling are paid by Anderson County, not by the City, so getting an accounting is not a straightforward matter. However, as Ray Evans says, the amounts going to the landfill have surely been reduced. </p>
<p>During the recent economic mess, our local hauler, (Waste Connections) says that recycling costs them more than it used to because markets are soft. The company is absorbing these costs, not their contractual customers (like the City of Oak Ridge).</p>
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		<title>By: Ray Kircher</title>
		<link>http://ellensmith.org/blog/2009/06/09/what-people-are-redeeming-their-recyclebank-rewards-points-for/comment-page-1/#comment-39081</link>
		<dc:creator>Ray Kircher</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 15 Jun 2009 13:48:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ellensmith.org/blog/?p=237#comment-39081</guid>
		<description>And what about the storing of recyclables Mr. Evans? Furthermore, I suspect many of the recyclers in Oak Ridge don’t even look at what they buy. How much of the recycled product is being purchased in the stores RecycleBank has coupons with? It isn’t what many recyclers say is a good deal to only sort recycled waste and not buy the product many are saying is the way to save our planet. It is simple, RecycleBank will only save their bankroll by passing the storage and shipping to third world countries costs onto our city council.

I would suspect all trash has dropped due to the economy, but garbage costs are expected to increase due to storage of recyclables. Next, if Waste Management chooses to dump these recyclables into Landfills, the tax must be paid resulting in a net loss for Waste Management. Then they have the option of dumping this waste in third world countries looking for a quick dollar for filling a hole in the ground, but that isn&#039;t green. Yet it happens. A double edged sword our council has given its citizens while not looking into programs that help Oak Ridgers.

The best way for our city to recycle is to create and promote our own programs that reduce landfill refuse. No other program would return the benefits of recycling. Why isn’t Waste Management purchasing methane fueled Recycling Trucks? The landfills they dump at are major contributors to climate methane release. What is good for the Goose is even better for the Gander.

All RecycleBank is good for is to make people feel good while facing higher costs from Waste Management in all of their services. Sad to see Oak Ridge cannot find service for itself by itself. This is the mindset being held from Oak Ridge citizens by a select few who want to feel good. Next on the recycling list, a fine for not sorting your garbage to offset recycled goods storage. The double standard is alive and well in Oak Ridge.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>And what about the storing of recyclables Mr. Evans? Furthermore, I suspect many of the recyclers in Oak Ridge don’t even look at what they buy. How much of the recycled product is being purchased in the stores RecycleBank has coupons with? It isn’t what many recyclers say is a good deal to only sort recycled waste and not buy the product many are saying is the way to save our planet. It is simple, RecycleBank will only save their bankroll by passing the storage and shipping to third world countries costs onto our city council.</p>
<p>I would suspect all trash has dropped due to the economy, but garbage costs are expected to increase due to storage of recyclables. Next, if Waste Management chooses to dump these recyclables into Landfills, the tax must be paid resulting in a net loss for Waste Management. Then they have the option of dumping this waste in third world countries looking for a quick dollar for filling a hole in the ground, but that isn&#8217;t green. Yet it happens. A double edged sword our council has given its citizens while not looking into programs that help Oak Ridgers.</p>
<p>The best way for our city to recycle is to create and promote our own programs that reduce landfill refuse. No other program would return the benefits of recycling. Why isn’t Waste Management purchasing methane fueled Recycling Trucks? The landfills they dump at are major contributors to climate methane release. What is good for the Goose is even better for the Gander.</p>
<p>All RecycleBank is good for is to make people feel good while facing higher costs from Waste Management in all of their services. Sad to see Oak Ridge cannot find service for itself by itself. This is the mindset being held from Oak Ridge citizens by a select few who want to feel good. Next on the recycling list, a fine for not sorting your garbage to offset recycled goods storage. The double standard is alive and well in Oak Ridge.</p>
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		<title>By: Ray Evans</title>
		<link>http://ellensmith.org/blog/2009/06/09/what-people-are-redeeming-their-recyclebank-rewards-points-for/comment-page-1/#comment-39080</link>
		<dc:creator>Ray Evans</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 15 Jun 2009 12:15:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ellensmith.org/blog/?p=237#comment-39080</guid>
		<description>I suspect that the tonnage going to the landfill has been significantly reduced thus reducing the cost somewhat.  The cost of the labor and equipment necessary to pick up the waste destined for the landfill likely remains unchanged.

There are both tangible and intangible benefits of this program.  An important intangible benefit is simply developing a sustainability mindset within our community.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I suspect that the tonnage going to the landfill has been significantly reduced thus reducing the cost somewhat.  The cost of the labor and equipment necessary to pick up the waste destined for the landfill likely remains unchanged.</p>
<p>There are both tangible and intangible benefits of this program.  An important intangible benefit is simply developing a sustainability mindset within our community.</p>
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		<title>By: Ray Kircher</title>
		<link>http://ellensmith.org/blog/2009/06/09/what-people-are-redeeming-their-recyclebank-rewards-points-for/comment-page-1/#comment-39079</link>
		<dc:creator>Ray Kircher</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 15 Jun 2009 11:56:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ellensmith.org/blog/?p=237#comment-39079</guid>
		<description>What are the stats of diversion? The actual amount of garbage going into our landfill is where we would know if Recycle Bank is worthwhile. You count how much has been recycled in a program geared for customers to cheat, but that wasn&#039;t the goal. The goal was to reduce the amount of trash sent to the landfill, thus reducing our garbage collection cost. Also, how much does the city pay per ton of garbage sent to the landfill? How much was sent before and after RecycleBank?

This is an interesting comment:

&quot;The township I live in has an award winning recycling program which includes the pick up of pet food tins. The recycling program also helps to keep our taxes as low as possible. 

If we diverted all of our pet food tins to the RecycleBank then that would result in a decrease of revenue for the township&#039;s recycling contractor, and defeat the purpose of the program.&quot;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>What are the stats of diversion? The actual amount of garbage going into our landfill is where we would know if Recycle Bank is worthwhile. You count how much has been recycled in a program geared for customers to cheat, but that wasn&#8217;t the goal. The goal was to reduce the amount of trash sent to the landfill, thus reducing our garbage collection cost. Also, how much does the city pay per ton of garbage sent to the landfill? How much was sent before and after RecycleBank?</p>
<p>This is an interesting comment:</p>
<p>&#8220;The township I live in has an award winning recycling program which includes the pick up of pet food tins. The recycling program also helps to keep our taxes as low as possible. </p>
<p>If we diverted all of our pet food tins to the RecycleBank then that would result in a decrease of revenue for the township&#8217;s recycling contractor, and defeat the purpose of the program.&#8221;</p>
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